FOSTER BOTHERS & CHATILLON & SON KNIVES COMPANY
1878-1956
THIS IS PAGE 11
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KNIFE WORLD - WHUT IZZIT NUMBER 220 APRIL 1996
by Bernard Levine (c)1996
This style of dive knife was made in large numbers during World
War II. Most navy hard hat divers used them, plus every
submarine carried them, as well. Some are unmarked, some are
marked Ka-Bar, and others are marked with the names of East Coast
diving equipment supply firms, such as Morse, Schrader, DESCO, or
Vince. I have never seen one with this particular marking
before.
I checked an old (1981) Thomas Register of American
Manufactures and found a likely candidate. It is the Chas.
Fischer Spring Co., with offices at 611-A Broadway, New York
City. Their one-line advertisement says "Emergency Short Run or
Full Production." I assume this refers to springs, not knives.
I tried calling the listed phone number, but it now belongs to
an irate private resident. Then I called directory assistance,
and the operator said that Fischer Spring inquiries were to be
referred to the Chatillon Co. of Kew Gardens, New York.
.. Tom Lent, Chatillon, 83-30 Kew Gardens Rd. K G NY 11415 212-847-5000
John Chatillon & Sons, Inc., is an old New York firm that
originally made its name in spring balances. A lot of these
balances were used in the retail meat business, which I suppose
is how Chatillon got into the butcher supply business. From this
it was a short jump into the cutlery business, which Chatillon
accomplished in 1904 to 1953 by (acquiring) the Foster Bros. Cutlery
Company of Fulton, New York. In the late 1930s Chatillon sold
private brand pocketknives. During World War II, Foster Bros.
made Marine Corps bolos and other more mundane cook and butcher
knives for the military, and these are usually marked CHATILLON.
I then called Chatillon and spoke to Mr. Tom Lent. He said
that Foster Bros. had been closed down in the 1950s.
(1956)The Foster
Bros. name is now owned by the Columbia Cutlery Corporation of
New York.
Today Chatillon still makes springs and scales, as well as a
variety of force measuring instruments for industry
(dynamometers, torque testers, tension and compression testers,
etc.). I asked him about Fischer Spring Company, but he was not
aware that Chatillon had acquired it. Perhaps that firm simply
closed down, and is referring would-be customers to Chatillon.
If he can find out the story, he will let me know.
Meanwhile, this does not do much to help explain General
Meyrowitz's "Fischer Spring" dive knife. I have known for years
that the Chatillon spring company was once in the knife business,
but this is the first evidence I have seen that the Fischer
Spring firm sold knives, too. Stay tuned for more information.
Hard hat diver knives are now worth around $200 in excellent
condition, except for the Ka-Bar marked examples, which bring at
least twice as much as any of the others.
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KNIFE WORLD - WHUT IZZIT NUMBER 221 MAY 1996
by Bernard Levine (c)1996
Last month Brig. Gen. Jesse Meyrowitz asked about a U.S. Navy
hard-hat diver's knife. Its cylindrical brass scabbard was
stamped C-713051 FISCHER SPRING, N.Y. I said at the time that I
had never seen a knife with this marking, but I forgot that I had
seen a picture of another one. Mr. M. H. Cole of Alabama
telephoned to remind me that he had included a drawing of a
similar knife on page 62 of his U.S. Military Knives... Book IV.
The example that he had drawn belongs to Mr. Herb Rosenbaum. It
differs from Gen. Meyrowitz's knife in that it has a non-ferrous
(or at least non-magnetic) blade, and the marking C-713051
FISCHER SPRING, N.Y. is on the blade, rather than on the
scabbard.
In my discussion of the Fischer Spring Company I discovered a
connection between it and John Chatillon & Sons, best known to
knife fanciers as the long-time owner of the Foster Brothers
Cutlery Company of Fulton, New York. Now Mr. Tom Lent of
Chatillon has sent in a reprint of an old poster about Foster
Bros. It was produced in the late 1940s by a city of Fulton
booster organization, most likely either the Chamber of Commerce
or the local newspaper. At the top of the poster is this old
photo of the two Foster brothers posing with some of their
employees, along with the following caption:
"Frank Foster is the man with the derby seated on the bench
[bottom row, second from right]. His brother Allie is the well
dressed fellow next to the anvil [bottom row, second from left].
All of these men were with Foster Brothers when this picture was
taken some time around 1880."
Here are the key points from the story printed on the rest of
the poster. Like virtually every knife story written in the
1940s, it hints at the existence of secret and mystical
properties imparted to blades by forge and anvil. Unfortunately
these stories tell us more about the technical ignorance of
writers and the gullibility of their readers back at that time,
than they do about the making of knives.
"Frank and Allie Foster had found a method of tempering steel
for the machine knives used in the paper mills along the Oswego
River prior to the year 1878 [Fulton is about 10 miles up the
Oswego River from the Lake Ontario port city of Oswego, and it is
about 20 miles north of Camillus]. They had taken the best steel
that could be bought--heated it and hammered it--and quenched and
hammered it again--always by hand, standing over the anvil
alongside their improvised forge. They had learned that even the
best steel had to be 'toughened' for use in cutlery.
"Their knives earned a local reputation that one day brought in
their first farmer customer--for a great knife to be used in
splitting the carcass of a hog.
"Others came--each with a request for a knife to do a
particular job--knives of many kinds--and sizes--but always to be
shaped by hand from the toughened steel that made 'Foster
Brothers' knives good...
"Ten years after Foster Brothers' first venture into the market
[actually in 1904], expanded facilities were provided through
affiliation with John Chatillon & Sons--already known as
producers of scales and other products for the Butcher Trade...
"Power hammers replaced the anvil--and modern methods speeded
up production to meet the competition that came with a broadening
world market. But the quality never varied.
"During the peak years of peace, more than fifty skilled
craftsmen found year round employment making more than 500
different sizes, shapes, and styles of knives.
"Largest of all are the splitting knives for the meat packers--
a 24-inch blade and a a 24-inch handle--four feet long over all
[see Levine's Guide III page 493, second from top]. The smallest
is a comparatively tiny blade used in dressing poultry [see LG-
III page 485, second up from bottom right].
"Some have handles of Coca Bola [cocobolo], a wood that comes
from Panama and Nicaragua. There are handles of Rosewood and
Ebony from South America and Africa; Black Walnut, Beech, Maple,
and Cherry from domestic sources.
"Before the war the Government called on Foster Brothers &
Chatillon to develop a formula for cutler's steel that was later
to become the standard of the industry [recall that Chatillon was
and still is in the testing instruments business].
"During the war the entire production was devoted to making
Cleavers and Butcher Knives used in the food supply service for
the Army and Navy. More than 200,000 Cleavers were made for the
Navy alone--and 50,000 more for the Army. Thousands of Hospital
Corps Knives were made for the Marines [LG-III page 441].
"Now production is back on a peace time basis. Employment is
at an all time peak with an annual payroll in Fulton of more than
$115,000.00. Many more thousands are spent locally for services,
supplies, materials, taxes, and the other costs of doing
business. [Dividing $115,000 among 50 employees yields an
average annual pay packet of $2,300. Talk about the good old
days?] That Average's 44.00 a week.
"It will take a full year to manufacture all the Foster
Brothers Knives now on order. Nine veteran salesmen, covering
America, are constantly alert to bring more and more orders to
Foster Brothers & Chatillon--orders for their famous knives--and
business to the city of Fulton which so proudly provides a home
for a good industry..."
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